Bugs when working with a front end

CD-i Emulator is the first fully evolving windows compatible emulator project of the Philips CD-i system. Discuss the emulator, compatibility issues, seek help and support to get the program operating and post what you'd like to see in future revisions of the program. CD-i players ROM (BIOS) requests, begging and links will not be tolerated. Otherwise feel free to post your thoughts on this amazing new piece of software.
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Nologic
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Bugs when working with a front end

Post by Nologic » Sun Jul 15, 2007 5:50 am

Hello,

I've been asked to create a loader for this emu, in order to get it to work with GameEx a very well renowned front end.

While working on this I've come across a few issues that I feel should be addressed as soon as possible.

1. While launching in fullscreen the taskbar area is not occupied by the Emu...and hence not truly fullscreen.

2. While launched in fullscreen and applying stretching, the mouse control is captured and forced continually to the left.

3. While fullscreen the mouse is clearly visible, while it should be made hidden...or at the very least a completely transparent cursor should be used.

4. No command line options to send the Emu to fullscreen, nor to remove toolbar, nor apply stretching.

5. No INI file in which to save default graphical settings (fullscreen, aspect, show toolbar,...)

6. Issues with Emu not asserting its self correctly in z depth (top most window) when launched by Front end.

I would like very much to see these issues addressed so that I can add whatever support I can for this one of a kind Emu...which in turn will draw more foot traffic to this site and forum...and in all likely hood increase revenue.

Thanks for your time and consideration.

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cdifan
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Post by cdifan » Sun Jul 15, 2007 10:00 am

These are valid issues, not all of them easy to solve.

It would help if I had access to your test version of the loader, so that I could address these issues for the next release.

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Post by Nologic » Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:12 am

You can find GameEx at the following link...[linky]

Executables and source can be downloaded here...this includes import files for GameEx which can be found in ".\Support\Import\" and should go "C:\Program Files\GameEx\CONFIG\EMULATORS\IMPORT-EXPORT\" then simply import them through the "Advanced Configuration" application that comes with GameEx

Now this should work with other front ends like MameWah...just will be a little more effort...since I haven't created any import\setup files for other FE's.

Source code is written in a simple scripting lang called AutoIt which can be found here.

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Post by Nologic » Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:44 am

Well I have released the loader so maybe you'll see a mild increase in foot traffic.

I honestly believe you should rethink your price point on this Emu..I'd suggest $10-15 USA, for typical software your current price point is acceptable...but for the market this applies to and the limited demand a lower price point would likely draw in more registered users & more income.

Also I'd suggest altering the way the shareware build is restricted.

First off remove the time limit...this I feel hurts you more than helps.

Instead I'd suggest removing the ability to enable streaching & possible future rendering filters...this is becoming a big issue with higher and higher resolutions being used on TV's and PC's.

Additionally I'd suggest a 1-3 second nag rendered in the Emu to register, prior to booting any disc...this will keep it frontend friendly & effective.

I think these would prove enough of annoyance to compel most regular users to register, while allowing more exposure of your Emu to the masses.

I'd bug you about a possible registered version...but I have only one game...and hopefully your next update will remove any need for a loader at all.

Well best of luck...oh and let me know if the Unlimited loader works correctly...it was done in the dark, and reported to work by only one person.

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Post by cdoty » Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:59 pm

Nologic wrote:I honestly believe you should rethink your price point on this Emu..I'd suggest $10-15 USA, for typical software your current price point is acceptable...but for the market this applies to and the limited demand a lower price point would likely draw in more registered users & more income.
I think you have to figure in the obscurity of the system, and available emulators. To date, this is by far the most complete emulator for the CD-I. No one in their right mind would stick with CD-Ice because it's free.
And from a developer's point of view, the extra features are well worh the 'extra' money. If anything maybe offer two price points, one with the extra features (developer and screen ripping type support, etc.), and one without. Even with two price points, I would guess more people would buy the version with extra features. They would probably want the extra features, just in case they ever need them.
Nologic wrote:First off remove the time limit...this I feel hurts you more than helps.

Additionally I'd suggest a 1-3 second nag rendered in the Emu to register, prior to booting any disc...this will keep it frontend friendly & effective.

I think these would prove enough of annoyance to compel most regular users to register, while allowing more exposure of your Emu to the masses.
The unlimited emulator with a time limit seems to work well with Magic Engine. It allows you to see exactly what you're getting, except it only lasts for a short time. The only down side to that is it could be hard to make sure a game will run correctly in the emulator.

There was an article (on GameDev.net maybe?) that talks about nag screens. They can annoy a user to the point where they don't want to use the software.
Visit RasterSoft on facebook or visit the website.

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Post by Nologic » Tue Jul 17, 2007 11:23 pm

Well I'm not interested in a debate...but some things to keep in mind, there is a reason the system is obscure; a three second nag is less annoying than having your game stop on you every three minutes; magic engine is a finished product and it sells for $20 USA; Saturn makes more money than Ferrari.

Every thing is simply suggestions so take them or leave them.

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Post by cdifan » Tue Jul 17, 2007 11:30 pm

I am still quite satisfied with the price point. Anybody seriously interested will not find it a problem, and more then halving it like you suggest would make it feel "cheap" to me. The little extra money it might bring in (but that would mean at least doubling the sales, which I think is unlikely to happen) isn't worth that to me.

I don't see why the time limit is hurting. It allows you to do a reasonable evaluation of the program; three minutes is plenty of time to evaluate how a particular CD-i game works with the emulator, which is really the point. I rather thought it would be just enough to get you hooked into a level, so you'd really have motivation to get an unlimited edition!

Personally I hate nag screens; the emulator already nags you once every thirty days (even in the unlimited version!) and that is really more then enough.
Nologic wrote:I'd bug you about a possible registered version...but I have only one game...and hopefully your next update will remove any need for a loader at all.
This I don't understand. Why would an update remove the need for a loader? If you mean that a longer playing time in the limited edition would cause you not to need the unlimited one, you are contradicting yourself.
CDoty wrote:And from a developer's point of view, the extra features are well worh the 'extra' money.
This was never my take on the money thing; I wouldn't really want to maintain a "user" and "developer" version anyway! Besides, you never know when a user becomes a developer. If we can make it easy enough...

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Post by Nologic » Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:42 am

Yes they would have to be serious as it would not be a purchase made on a whim...as a person can pick up an actual CD-i and a small handful of games for the same amount of cash.

Personally when a application stops working for me in 20min or less...it gets uninstalled bar none. A nag may annoy me to the point that I remove it...but generally speaking it takes far longer and I have far more exposure to the application, and hence a greater likely hood of making the purchase. Since extremely few applications use such restrictive time limits for demonstration most prospective buyers will ether not get the exposer they require...or they will likely feel inclined to believe that the author is trying to hide shoddy programming. The fact the application in its current state can not save default settings or go truly fullscreen only strengthens a negative view of it.

I'm actually confused by this bit "Personally I hate nag screens;" in reality you have a nag screen from hell that pops up every 3min...that not only nags one to buy the software, it actually causes the end user to loose all progress they have made.

Well ideally the update would introduce proper CLI options to get things up and running, the ability to save settings to a INI...so on and so forth...basically getting ether version up and running the same, and uncluttered...which currently the Limited edition is a larger pain in the ass than the Unlimited.

I honestly feel the price is to high, and that your demonstrating your application incorrectly. Tho at the end of the day its still your baby.

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Post by Bas » Mon Jul 23, 2007 3:57 pm

Nologic wrote:Well I'm not interested in a debate...
then.... please.

Very nice development by the way, although I don't really know what a front loader is about :oops:

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